[Dan00Hawk]

First post, potential new owner.

My current daily driver is a 2017 VW GTI with a stage 1 tune, and my new job that starts next month will likely require me to have something with more cargo capability along with AWD for my sales territory in the northern midwest (ND, SD, MN, WI, IL, MI). I'm married, 1 - 10 year old, and 3 mid-size dogs (Aussies). New company will give me a healthy car allowance and pays for all fuel and oil changes. So decent gas mileage or a hybid don't really benefit me. $30-$40k is my desired price range. I'm not interested in a full size or even a mid size truck due to driving dynamics. A Santa Cruz SEL Premium AWD seems to hit the sweet spot for me.

So things like the Santa Cruz, Maverick, and Rav4 Prime are among my top considerations. The likely performance advantage of the SC over the Maverick, and the styling of the SC is making me lean more towards the Hyundai, even though the Maverick in "comparable trim" would be about $5k less. The federal tax credit of $7500 of the Rav4 Prime and the straight line performance of the Toyota are appealing and make the price competitive, but the styling is a bit blah to me.

Burger tuning makes a JB4 tuner device for the Stinger 2.5T, Kia K5 2.5t, Sonata 2.5T, Santa Fe 2.5T, and Genesis 2.5T. So it stands to reason they'll offer it for the Santa Cruz 2.5T as well. As it's a piggyback design, they don't reflash the tune, and can be removed for dealer trips or warranty concerns. An extra 4-6psi of boost on the Santa Cruz and 30-40 hp and tq on 91/93 octane, or +60 hp and tq on an E20 blend sounds quite appealing. JB4 for Kia / Hyundai 2.5T, 3.5T, SmartStream, and K5 (BETA) . Seems like the 2.5T on other platforms like the Sonata, Stinger, Genesis and SUVs are hitting 0-60 in 5.0-6.0 seconds (faster times for the lighter cars), and a quarter mile trap speed around 99-105mph. So depending on weight of the Santa Cruz, it should be right there in stock form. An extra boost from a tuner would move this "Sport Truck" into quite a sleeper, right? Anyone else interested in the 2.5t for the straightline performance capability?


Also an open bed means I'd have the cargo room needed for my demonstration products for work, and possibly be able to move my motorcycle (Husqvarna Svartpilen 401, 330 lb dry weight) around without a trailer when needed. Although it's been easy and cheap to get a Uhaul trailer for <$20/day to tow with my GTI, so I could fall back on that if necessary. Any idea how long the bed and dropped tailgate will be with the bed cover removed? I need at least 70" from the leading edge of my front tire of the Husky to the rear wheel footprint for it to fit safely in the bed and on the tailgate. Tailgate appears to be rated at 500 lbs, so should be fine for me. Or possibly use a hitch mounted motorcycle rack if the SC has a class 3/4 hitch rated for 500 lbs. But has anyone seen a hitch rating yet? I'd assume at least 500 lbs if it can tow 5000 lbs as a 10% tongue weight is considered typical.

Anyway, I'm close to just making a reservation so I can get one before winter... Any help y'all can provide with some of my questions would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Chuck]

I might be interested in the tuner. One of my coworkers has one (I think from Burger) on his Optima - which they are now updating/reflashing to use on his '22 G70.

 

[Rxturbo7man]

First post, potential new owner.

My current daily driver is a 2017 VW GTI with a stage 1 tune, and my new job that starts next month will likely require me to have something with more cargo capability along with AWD for my sales territory in the northern midwest (ND, SD, MN, WI, IL, MI). I'm married, 1 - 10 year old, and 3 mid-size dogs (Aussies). New company will give me a healthy car allowance and pays for all fuel and oil changes. So decent gas mileage or a hybid don't really benefit me. $30-$40k is my desired price range. I'm not interested in a full size or even a mid size truck due to driving dynamics. A Santa Cruz SEL Premium AWD seems to hit the sweet spot for me.

So things like the Santa Cruz, Maverick, and Rav4 Prime are among my top considerations. The likely performance advantage of the SC over the Maverick, and the styling of the SC is making me lean more towards the Hyundai, even though the Maverick in "comparable trim" would be about $5k less. The federal tax credit of $7500 of the Rav4 Prime and the straight line performance of the Toyota are appealing and make the price competitive, but the styling is a bit blah to me.

Burger tuning makes a JB4 tuner device for the Stinger 2.5T, Kia K5 2.5t, Sonata 2.5T, Santa Fe 2.5T, and Genesis 2.5T. So it stands to reason they'll offer it for the Santa Cruz 2.5T as well. As it's a piggyback design, they don't reflash the tune, and can be removed for dealer trips or warranty concerns. An extra 4-6psi of boost on the Santa Cruz and 30-40 hp and tq on 91/93 octane, or +60 hp and tq on an E20 blend sounds quite appealing. JB4 for Kia / Hyundai 2.5T, 3.5T, SmartStream, and K5 (BETA) . Seems like the 2.5T on other platforms like the Sonata, Stinger, Genesis and SUVs are hitting 0-60 in 5.0-6.0 seconds (faster times for the lighter cars), and a quarter mile trap speed around 99-105mph. So depending on weight of the Santa Cruz, it should be right there in stock form. An extra boost from a tuner would move this "Sport Truck" into quite a sleeper, right? Anyone else interested in the 2.5t for the straightline performance capability?


Also an open bed means I'd have the cargo room needed for my demonstration products for work, and possibly be able to move my motorcycle (Husqvarna Svartpilen 401, 330 lb dry weight) around without a trailer when needed. Although it's been easy and cheap to get a Uhaul trailer for <$20/day to tow with my GTI, so I could fall back on that if necessary. Any idea how long the bed and dropped tailgate will be with the bed cover removed? I need at least 70" from the leading edge of my front tire of the Husky to the rear wheel footprint for it to fit safely in the bed and on the tailgate. Tailgate appears to be rated at 500 lbs, so should be fine for me. Or possibly use a hitch mounted motorcycle rack if the SC has a class 3/4 hitch rated for 500 lbs. But has anyone seen a hitch rating yet? I'd assume at least 500 lbs if it can tow 5000 lbs as a 10% tongue weight is considered typical.

Anyway, I'm close to just making a reservation so I can get one before winter... Any help y'all can provide with some of my questions would be appreciated. Thanks!

Had a Burger JB4 in an Infiniti Q50-S I sold last week, the Infiniti with the JB4 kicked butt, didn't even need to remove it for state emission testing. While for now I've soured on the Santa Cruz, feel an N version will be forthcoming, concerns on bed length and other design features. My original intent was to install a JB4, would definitely be quite the sleeper. Would have concerns on fitting a motorcycle in a Cruz, possibly with the tailgate down it would fit; they show a bicycle hanging over the tailgate in the up postion. Not many vehicles will replicate the GTI experience, they've always been on my shortlist; looking forward to the Mk 8 release.

 

[REPeet]

I'm interested in straight line performance. With a bed in the back, it should have some stout swaybars in the rear too. It looks like the price is getting to high for me, but I'm still paying attention.

 

[Dan00Hawk]

Bed length on the Explorer Sport Trac was 50" (2" shorter than the Santa Cruz), and about 70" with the tailgate down, which did allow shorter motorcycles to ride back there on the tailgate. Here is a Honda CRF 250x with a 58.3" wheelbase fitting in one.

The wheel base on my Svartpilen 401 (53.4") is 5" shorter than that Honda. So with the bed of the Santa Cruz being a little larger than the Sport Trac, I think my bike will fit just fine as long as the tailgate is at least 18" tall. But I haven't seen that dimension yet...

Current setup with my GTI and motorcycle:

 

[deznut2]

The roll up bed cover may take away some of the usable bed length...I don't know how hard it is to remove to give us all of the bed length for a motorcycle...I know a Ridgeline will hold bikes, but it's high tailgate height makes it a pain to load...plan on taking my tape measure down to the dealer when they one in.

 

[Dan00Hawk]

The roll up bed cover may take away some of the usable bed length...I don't know how hard it is to remove to give us all of the bed length for a motorcycle...I know a Ridgeline will hold bikes, but it's high tailgate height makes it a pain to load...plan on taking my tape measure down to the dealer when they one in.

Yeah, it does not appear that a front tire on a motorcycle would fit under that area where the bed retracts. I thought I recall reading or watching a video that said removing 6 bolts will allow the tonneau cover assembly to be removed. So while it may not be a 30 second job, it's probably easily done within 15 minutes which would be acceptable to me to get the extra space necessary for taller items in the bed near the cab.

The open tailgate appears to be nearly in line with the top of the Santa Cruz tires from photos, maybe just above that line. Basically, it's the thickness of the tailgate above the top of the rear plastic on the bumper when viewing the truck from the side. Based on a 245/50 R20 tire (29.6" tall), that would make the load height onto the open tailgate right around 30"-32" high. Ridgeline load height seems to be about 35" from what I've read.

A longer folding ramp that is arched like this should also make loading a motorcycle an easier task when done with 2 people. Or 2 ramps to do it by oneself to walk next to the bike while controlling the throttle and clutch.

Larin Foldable Steel Loading Ramp - BFLR-1 | Blain's Farm & Fleet

Get your Larin Foldable Steel Loading Ramp - BFLR-1 at Blain's Farm & Fleet. Buy online, choose delivery or in-store pickup. Great prices on Loading Ramps.

www.farmandfleet.com

 

[ToadVine]

Heh, heh, dueling ramps! I'll see your steel ramp and raise you to aluminum triple-wides! ($20 more, but, hey...)

 

[modshack]

I have the AFE Scorcher (similar but simpler than the JB4) on my new Veloster N and it's a great mod. Since these piggybacks just interface with the MAP and boost pressure controls I suspect anything for the 2.5 should be a compatible bolt on. 15 minute install, Plug and play. There's a developing tuner community for these 2.0 and 2.5 engines so it should be an easy upgrade. I'm likely at 325hp now and the engine runs great with awesome driveability with 4 selectable maps accessible via a simple pushbutton dongle in the cabin.

 

[JMII]

Anyone else interested in the 2.5t for the straightline performance capability?

Not so much as a stop light racer (my other car is a C7 Z51 that sees track time) but in general YES I want a sporty truck... so the turbo with the DCT should provide that. I might consider the chip down the road but hopefully the stock performance is enough for it to be a fun driver.

My brother tracked at Golf R for awhile, that thing surprised a lot of other HPDE drivers. He was APR Stage II, coil overs, AWD controller, Audi TT brakes plus some other mods - it was hoot.

 

[AndyTA]

Not trying to be a debbie-downer - but 0-60 in anything in the 5's to 6's is not a sleeper, at all by today's standards. Especially with Electric motors - they've kind of ruined the standard...by making them far too quick, haha.

I want the Santa Cruz for it's styling + utility - I already have my "fun car" (1000+ hp '99 Trans am). It's why I currently own a '22 Kona, for the Utility, but the SC will trump the Kona in the Utility department. Only reason I am even considering one. Definitely not looking at it for it's straight line capability - it's just not built with that in mind. But people will be people, and try to race anything they can... (me included, by the way).

 

[HSC4ME]

Not trying to be a debbie-downer - but 0-60 in anything in the 5's to 6's is not a sleeper, at all by today's standards. Especially with Electric motors - they've kind of ruined the standard...by making them far too quick, haha.

The BIG question is, what does repeated 5 second 0-60mph do to your range?

 

[Dan00Hawk]

Not trying to be a debbie-downer - but 0-60 in anything in the 5's to 6's is not a sleeper, at all by today's standards. Especially with Electric motors - they've kind of ruined the standard...by making them far too quick, haha.

I want the Santa Cruz for it's styling + utility - I already have my "fun car" (1000+ hp '99 Trans am). It's why I currently own a '22 Kona, for the Utility, but the SC will trump the Kona in the Utility department. Only reason I am even considering one. Definitely not looking at it for it's straight line capability - it's just not built with that in mind. But people will be people, and try to race anything they can... (me included, by the way).

Oh, I know it's not gonna compete with forced induction muscle and Euro tuner cars and performance E cars like Teslas and Porsches. But for the money brand new (sub $40k), all the 2.5t cars from Hyundai/Kia are respectably quick and would certainly shock most of the non-enthusiast types in their regular vehicles, especially running an extra 50hp from a plug in tuner.

I've still got my 2000 Trans Am Firehawk Convertible with just a cam and bolt ons for fun, even though it's a heavy street car that only traps 115mph in the 1/4, which is run of the mill for entry level factory muscle cars now. But I still think having a lightly tuned Santa Cruz 2.5T as a daily driven mid 13 second vehicle that traps 105mph or so would surprise a few fellas with their full-size pickups, 5.7 Hemi Chargers/Challengers, and sport compact imports though. So yeah, it'd be a sleeper to those that expect it to accelerate on par with a regular Hyundai Tucson or Honda CRV or other basic crossover.

 

[Dan00Hawk]

Heh, heh, dueling ramps! I'll see your steel ramp and raise you to aluminum triple-wides! ($20 more, but, hey...)

Hey, that's cheaper and lighter than buying 2 of the steel ramps! I'd likely go with something that folds in half at less than 50" when folded, so it could still fit inside the closed tailgate when necessary. I'd probably spend a bit more for aluminum myself over the steel, but I was just demonstrating how cheap one can get a longer folding arched ramp.

 

[Innate]

Coming from a 2021 Ridgeline, I think my Limited SC handles way better and is a lot quicker to boot. Been taking it fairly easy while breaking it in but I can tell, at least for my needs, this thing's gonna cook! Doubt I'd ever put a tuner on it since it sets you back pretty good as is in Sport when you hit it. Didn't buy it for 0-60. Wanted the comfort, quietness and usability a nice small AWD truck brings. Get the biggest kick out of 99% of the full sized pickups I see... a big empty box of air in the back with 4 doors and one person in it.

 

[Darth Cruzer]

Burger tuning makes a JB4 tuner device for the Stinger 2.5T, Kia K5 2.5t, Sonata 2.5T, Santa Fe 2.5T, and Genesis 2.5T. So it stands to reason they'll offer it for the Santa Cruz 2.5T as well. As it's a piggyback design, they don't reflash the tune, and can be removed for dealer trips or warranty concerns. An extra 4-6psi of boost on the Santa Cruz and 30-40 hp and tq on 91/93 octane, or +60 hp and tq on an E20 blend sounds quite appealing. JB4 for Kia / Hyundai 2.5T, 3.5T, SmartStream, and K5 (BETA) . Seems like the 2.5T on other platforms like the Sonata, Stinger, Genesis and SUVs are hitting 0-60 in 5.0-6.0 seconds (faster times for the lighter cars), and a quarter mile trap speed around 99-105mph. So depending on weight of the Santa Cruz, it should be right there in stock form. An extra boost from a tuner would move this "Sport Truck" into quite a sleeper, right? Anyone else interested in the 2.5t for the straightline performance capability?

Just saw that Burger now included the Santa Cruz on its applications.

 

[Walking Black Bear]

...this thing's gonna cook! Doubt I'd ever put a tuner on it since it sets you back pretty good as is in

Definitely! On my test drive loop yesterday I left a stop light on the highway, (auto hold on, foot off the brake - love that) heading UPHILL, 18 wheeler stopped behind me. Punched it on green and was up to speed before the cab of the rig was through the intersection. The only thing I found with a slightly spirited launch, and by that I mean MAYBE half throttle - it's not broken in, after all, is that a) there's definitely a moment of turbo lag and b) once the turbo spooled up the tires chirped, traction control dialed it back, and there was a bit of a lurch/hesitation before it pulls away and just keeps pulling. That DCT is SO freaking smooth.

 

[Sparkland]

Just saw that Burger now included the Santa Cruz on its applications.
View attachment 2166

Any chance the Hyundai dealer will blacklist your SC when they find out there were only two starts on your vehicle after you removed the Burger tune? That happens to Subaru owners if they come across a nasty dealer?

 

[Dan00Hawk]

Any chance the Hyundai dealer will blacklist your SC when they find out there were only two starts on your vehicle after you removed the Burger tune? That happens to Subaru owners if they come across a nasty dealer?

The JB4 is a "piggy-back" that doesn't reflash anything in the ECU. It's not a true tune in that sense, but it modifies the signals to adjust boost, fuel, and timing.The JB4 is essentially a programmable computer that attaches between the ECU and vehicle sensors allowing it to adjust your vehicle's tuning by tapping into areas of the factory flash mapping that are not normally available. Thus, once it's unplugged and removed (15 minute process), nothing is detectable in the memory of the ECU. That's the beauty of it in order to maintain a warranty.

I ended up passing on the SantaCruz, but stayed in the family with a 2022 Kia Stinger GT-Line 2.5t AWD. Got nearly $3k off MSRP and a lot of vehicle for the money. So I went with a hatchback instead of the truck bed. Still waiting on Burger to release the JB4 for these engines with the proper clips. It's available and in use on other vehicles with the 2.5t, but the clips need to be taped or ziptied for use. Hyundai/Kia isn't releasing the new clips for the 2.5t yet, possibly due to supply shortage issues that now seem the new normal unfortunately. I'll probably just wait until spring at this point.

I still dig the SC and will hang around the community here from time to time. Might get one in the future still, so want to see how they work out for owners.

 

[WI.EC]

Piggy back tuners can be detected by engine software and do leave traces, so the most definitely can void a warranty. Saying that they can be removed without any trace is false and needs to stop being mentioned in this forum.