I posted on here before (not sure if it was this thread or not) that every car company is tight selling new cars so we'll probably be paying MSRP with no negotiation room. Which makes it all the more irritating when the factory is dumping on accessories (saw the one headed to my dealer has carpeted floor mats and weather liners - why both???) so they jack jack up the price. But it is definitely a seller's market - if we want to play we gotta play. But like you said, negotiation starts at the trade in time!I was notified by the dealer there are NO discounts, but NO premium either. So I''ll pay MSRP... the only "talk" with the dealer will be on trade-in value. I accept this for wanting to be on the early delivery list. Trade off for being impatient. My suggestion to all is to complete the credit app (if needed) prior to actual delivery. That speeds up the delivery process greatly.